Castlepoint: Decision Required

[Jon (aka site admin)]

A no brainer??   See http://www.peakbagging.co.nz/forums/index.php/topic,523.0.html

Put it on the list?  yay or nay?

Too small?

[vinodrinker]

hmmm good question. My initial thought is it is too small

but it has plenty of wow factor and is in a "must visit" location

not sure it has what it takes to be an official peak though??

[GuanoGerbil]

It would be awesome to have this on the list because it is just so, well, awesome! 
However, I agree with Vino in that although this is a must do place to go, I don't feel as though it really has that real peak feeling to it. It's more a great lookout point than a peak unfortunately.

[Jon (aka site admin)]

although I haven't been up it since I was a kid, I tend to agree that's it's probably too small...

if it was a bit closer to wellington it might help, but it is quite a drive out there.

That reminds me, there is another little hill out there somewhere (on private land) that was the first place Anzac day was commemorated I think.   It's tiny as well, but of interest all the same.  there's some accommodation on the farm where it is....    here we go: Tinui Mountain http://www.holidayhouses.co.nz/properties/9115.asp, I'll give them a free plug!

[GuanoGerbil]

The fact that it is so far away is a draw. Surely this is what peakbagging is all about after all - taking us out to wonderful new places we haven't been to before. I don't think we want to go down the road of only naming peaks nearby to cities - I think Wellington has got more than it's fair share of peaks already.

With no definate peak to it, no trig and no views, Te Toiokawharu is surely only on the list because it is so close to Auckland. Hakarimata fits into the same catagory as this one, it too having no definate peak, no trig and no views, and for this reason I don't think it should be included. It too is also simply the highest point of a range, and I don't think that is enough justification to include it as a peak. If these weren't so close to cities they wouldn't even be up for consideration. I think we want to be wary of including these sorts of 'peaks' in the future. Just my humble opinion of course 

As far as Castle Rock goes, it's a hard call for me on this one as it is such an amazing place that it would be nice to share it on this site by naming it as an official peak. However I have to remind myself that there are plenty of incredible lookout points as well which aren't on the tops of things, so they can't be included. This is a spectacular lookout point which happens to be on the top of a big and intimidating looking hill. If there was a trig on the top it would probably be a goer though. Anyone have some spare timber lying around? 

[vinodrinker]

I think Te Toiokawharu as the tallest peak in a major range is good enough for inclusion. sure no views but still knocking off the tallest accessible peaks in a range is also what bagging is about.

You could put Mt mcdonald mclean as perhaps the tallest peak with views in waitakere's but that is hardly a challenge...5 minutes walk from a carpark and id rather climb the tallest peak through mud which is the flavour of the area!

[Jon (aka site admin)]

The fact that it is so far away is a draw. Surely this is what peakbagging is all about after all - taking us out to wonderful new places we haven't been to before. I don't think we want to go down the road of only naming peaks nearby to cities - I think Wellington has got more than it's fair share of peaks already.

well I half agree with this, and half don't 

Yes I agree one of the best things about peak bagging is discovering new places, and drawing attention to parts of the country that don't mentioned much otherwise.

On the flipside, I think it's good to give a little preference to ones near population centres.... just so people can have a go at it without having to travel too far.  but we already have all the major centres covered well enough really.

either way, I agree about castle point....

I haven't personally visited Te Toiokawharu and Hakarimata.  By your description, I can't say Te Toiokawharu sounds that rewarding, but depends on your point of view- again it made it on the original list by virtue of finding some close to Auckland.

Did we decide on an upper limit?  Maybe we shouldn't worry too much about removing ones until we reach that limit, and then after that we can demote ones that aren't worthy in the final wash....??

anyway, arguments are good though!  keep em coming

[vinodrinker]

I haven't personally visited Te Toiokawharu and Hakarimata.  By your description, I can't say Te Toiokawharu sounds that rewarding, but depends on your point of view- again it made it on the original list by virtue of finding some close to Auckland.

I think its a good typical auckland peak. although the actual summit is nothing to write home about the trip up is interesting enough with some good steep sections, a great kauri tree and a few lookout points along the way (and plenty of mud!!).

Putting the tallest point in the waitakere's and the tallest point in the hunuas on the list was a no brainer imo

[GuanoGerbil]

I wasn’t suggesting that we remove Te Toiokawharu, merely pointing out that it wouldn’t even have been considered if it wasn’t so close to Auckland. There are a lot of big ranges around the country and I don’t think the Waitakeres would be considered to be a major one by anyone living outside of Auckland.

Saying that, I can now understand your reasoning for including this one thanks Jon. I guess there are a lot of people up there, so this ‘peak’ would still be considered significant to a good portion of the country’s potential baggers. And as Vino says, it does boast a cool kauri and a decent lookout part way up which still makes the trip worthwhile.

When you think about all the reasons for consideration as to whether to include a peak or not, I think ultimately, in a nutshell, we would all like the experience to be a rewarding one.

Which brings me to another subject (and I'm playing devils advocate here)... I drove up One Tree Hill a few weeks ago and was blown away not only by the wind, but by the outstanding view up there. OK you can drive up there, but what a landmark, and what an incredible view! Should this be considered a peak even though you can drive up to it, or is a significant walk mandatory? 

[vinodrinker]

I wasn’t suggesting that we remove Te Toiokawharu, merely pointing out that it wouldn’t even have been considered if it wasn’t so close to Auckland. There are a lot of big ranges around the country and I don’t think the Waitakeres would be considered to be a major one by anyone living outside of Auckland.

Probably true, but ditto could be said of others eg Ngongotaha with its proximity to Rotorua, a number of the Wellington peaks off the top of my head.  I guess for someone like me that has lived in Auckland for nearly 30 years it is a range i see every day and is more significant than someone living in Gore.  It actually felt good to me to tick off the "double" being Te Toiokawharu tallest point in 'west' auckland and Kohukohunui tallest point in 'East' Auckland.

[Jon (aka site admin)]

Yes the road thing is interesting.  There's already some on the list that have dirt roads up them...... usually private I think, but people probably could drive up if they really wanted.

Likewise, I did notice someone was ticking off peaks they'd cycled up (naughty naughy  ), but well...  what are ya gonna do.

Another with a road up it is Mt John, by Lake Tekapo.  It's pretty small, by prominence anyway, and it does have a cafe and observatory at the top, but man, the views are awesome, and there is a walking track.

On One Tree Hill, I think we discussed once before making a page for a circular day walk, that takes in One Tree Hill, Mt eden and some off the others.  There's a walk like that in a book I have I think.....  if you guys vote yes to putting that on the list, I could make a page for that and we could come up with something that makes a meaningful walk... ?

[GuanoGerbil]

I didn’t mean to single out Te Toiokawharu specifically - I was just using this as an example. I agree that Ngongataha also fits into the same catagory due to it’s absolute none existant views. They really need a viewing platform built up there, and then it would be a fantastic bag!

I originally wouldn’t have considered anything you could drive up to as a possibility for official status. However I’m beginning to question that thought now. Is it really necessary to walk up something to still enjoy a great peak? Ideally yes, but maybe not necessarily if that peak is something really special. To discount a really beautiful peak with fantastic views simply because you don’t necessarily have to walk up it may sound a bit precious to some.

I don’t know. Maybe we could include a select few that are so spectacular that they really simply can’t be ignored. These would have to be exceptional though.

[vinodrinker]

Agree some viewing platforms would be great.  I wish the powers would dispense with the unnecessary boardwalks and stairs on Kohukohunui and put the money into a viewing tower like the one on Pirongia or Kakepuku!